UK Pension & Voluntary Payments Questions

[Mr Tardy]

Thanks Friendly Fox,

Unfortunately, using the overseas number below I had a different experience from Deep Blue.

The staff were helpful, but when I tried to find out if my state pension would increase if I paid the shortfall - as required by my letter from HMRC, they said they’d have to transfer me to the Pension Service - using the number that caused Deep Blue so much trouble.

They couldn’t get through, so I had to try the Pension Service number myself. Three tries, and the line hangs up once I select the “pension forecast” option.

There was a voice advert about using gov.co.uk to get my pension forcast - but my letter, of 2023, explicitly states I must call the Pension Service for this.

Any advice or insights would be much appreciated!

Back transfer is fine, but before sending them a payment you should first call national insurance enquiries to confirm the years you want to back pay and the total amount this will cost. They will then give you a code to attach to your bank transfer.

When I did this it took a while to get through (calling as soon as they open might make it quicker), but once I did they were very helpful. I'd recommend getting Skype credit or similar to make the call as there's a chance you could be waiting for a while.

Details from their site:

Number
0300 200 3500

Overseas
+44 191 203 7010

Monday to Friday: 8am to 6pm

[Mr Tardy]

Did you try to request a pension forecast, Deep Blue?

My HMRC letter stated I had to, and the people at Friendly Fox’s number were unable to help me. They tried to transfer me to the crappy number you were using and immediately bounced 3 times. I had as much luck as them on my own.

Back transfer is fine, but before sending them a payment you should first call national insurance enquiries to confirm the years you want to back pay and the total amount this will cost. They will then give you a code to attach to your bank transfer.

When I did this it took a while to get through (calling as soon as they open might make it quicker), but once I did they were very helpful. I'd recommend getting Skype credit or similar to make the call as there's a chance you could be waiting for a while.

Details from their site:

Number
0300 200 3500

Overseas
+44 191 203 7010

Monday to Friday: 8am to 6pm

You are my hero!!!!!! I have been trying to pay back missing years since September, when I filled in the online CF83 form and then the whole process stopped.

I had been trying to call a different number from gov.uk site for overseas callers which never got answered and often hung up randomly when I was queuing, often for half an hour or more. It was beyond frustrating. +44 191 218 3600 was the crappy number I wasted plenty of dollars waiting on.

I just called your number, got answered instantly and spoke to a helpful chap called Brian who found a letter was sent to me in November (which never arrived) and re-issued it. Plus, he gave me the figure I needed to pay to make up my missing four years (about 660 quid) and guided me to the payments section. I did an online transfer with the reference code (NI number+IC+SURNAME+INITIAL) and the whole thing was resolved in 12 minutes flat.

Thank you!

[Deep Blue]

I can access my state pension forecast on gov.uk. I had filled out CF 83 online back in September.

Interestingly the re-issued letter arrived a couple of days ago. And the payment instructions are different to what I was told and what I actually used. But it did confirm I’m eligible for class 2, unlike the website which only lets me pay class 3 online.

It’s vastly better than it was a few years ago but it’s not quite seamless yet.

[FriendlyFox]

It's been a while since I did it now, but I do remember having issues similar to yours with the other phone number.

I think I may have checked my pension forecast and NI payment record online, decided which years I wanted to back pay, and told the person on the number that picks up that I had indeed confirmed this with the pensions service. Hopefully this will be enough for you to clear that hurdle.

[Mr Tardy]

What was the difference in the payment instructions, Deep Blue?

Did it state that you had to have a confirmation from the Pension Service to confirm if your State Pension will increase if you pay any shortfall?

I can access my state pension forecast on gov.uk. I had filled out CF 83 online back in September.

Interestingly the re-issued letter arrived a couple of days ago. And the payment instructions are different to what I was told and what I actually used. But it did confirm I’m eligible for class 2, unlike the website which only lets me pay class 3 online.

It’s vastly better than it was a few years ago but it’s not quite seamless yet.

[Mr Tardy]

I’ll have to first see if I can get my Government Gateway Class 3 NICs converted to my ‘letter’ Class 2 NICs - both the NIC section, and the Pension Forecast have not reflected the change stated in my HMRC letter of late 2023.

Then if everything looks fine-and-dandy on the GG after that, I think I should be able to pay using your guidance… fingers crossed!

Seriously though - it shouldn’t have to be this hard!

I had tried a different Pension Service line, and the lady there couldn’t help me - but bemoaned the delays on the official number - she’d taken many tries and eventually a one-and-a-half hour call to sort out a minor matter for herself!

It's been a while since I did it now, but I do remember having issues similar to yours with the other phone number.

I think I may have checked my pension forecast and NI payment record online, decided which years I wanted to back pay, and told the person on the number that picks up that I had indeed confirmed this with the pensions service. Hopefully this will be enough for you to clear that hurdle.

[Deep Blue]

What was the difference in the payment instructions, Deep Blue?

Well, this is what the letter said.

Paying your voluntary NICS For information about paying voluntary NICs while abroad, go to:

www.gov.uk/pay-voluntary-class-3-national-insurance
www.gov.uk/pay-class-2-national-insurance

and choose the option 'Make an online or telephone bank transfer'.

Then follow the instructions shown under the heading 'Overseas Payments'.

Important notice

As an overseas customer you'll need to quote your National Insurance number when sending any payments to us. Please do not quote any other reference shown on our correspondence as this will mean that your payment will be sent to another part of HMRC. This will delay us processing your payment. For information about claiming benefits if you live, work or travel abroad, go to www.gov.uk/claim-benefits-abroad Please tell us if you change your address or stop working while abroad or if you return to the UK.

Yours sincerely
Sophie Atkinson
Assistant Officer

It sounds like I should use my NI number as a payment reference (my bold)

But when I follow the links in the letter I get to this page

https://www.gov.uk/pay-class-2-national ... k-transfer

which says this

If you either live abroad or live in the UK but are paying for a period when you worked abroad, you need to use a different reference number.

Use your National Insurance number followed by ‘IC’, your surname then your initial.

If your bank limits you to a certain number of characters, you should use your National Insurance number followed by ‘IC’ and as much of your surname as possible.

Examples

If your name is Anne Jones and your National Insurance number is QQ123456A, you’d write the reference as QQ123456AICJONESA

If your name is John Douglas-Hamilton and your National Insurance number is QQ123456A, you’d write the reference as QQ123456AICDOUGLAS-HAMILTONJ

This NI + IC + SURNAME + INITIAL code is the one I actually used.

Will be interesting to see when the payments are credited. Since the code I used contains the NI number mentioned in the letter I think it shoudl be ok regardless.... maybe needs a human to click it though rather than being automatically credited - not sure...

[Mr Tardy]

Just off the phone with the HMRC Central Office.

I’ve been told that the Government Gateway will NOT reflect changes from Class 3 to Class 2 NICs, and the HMRC system doesn’t communicate with the Pension system - hence the need to phone State Pensions.

The very helpful lady there tried to connect me to them internally - but 3 times it bounced just as the waiting musak was starting to play.

She sent them a callback request for me, we’ll see how that goes - not hopeful, but you never know!

[Mr Tardy]

Thanks for the info, Deep Blue - I hope everything goes smoothly!

What was the difference in the payment instructions, Deep Blue?

Well, this is what the letter said.

Paying your voluntary NICS For information about paying voluntary NICs while abroad, go to:

www.gov.uk/pay-voluntary-class-3-national-insurance
www.gov.uk/pay-class-2-national-insurance

and choose the option 'Make an online or telephone bank transfer'.

Then follow the instructions shown under the heading 'Overseas Payments'.

Important notice

As an overseas customer you'll need to quote your National Insurance number when sending any payments to us. Please do not quote any other reference shown on our correspondence as this will mean that your payment will be sent to another part of HMRC. This will delay us processing your payment. For information about claiming benefits if you live, work or travel abroad, go to www.gov.uk/claim-benefits-abroad Please tell us if you change your address or stop working while abroad or if you return to the UK.

Yours sincerely
Sophie Atkinson
Assistant Officer

It sounds like I should use my NI number as a payment reference (my bold)

But when I follow the links in the letter I get to this page

https://www.gov.uk/pay-class-2-national ... k-transfer

which says this

If you either live abroad or live in the UK but are paying for a period when you worked abroad, you need to use a different reference number.

Use your National Insurance number followed by ‘IC’, your surname then your initial.

If your bank limits you to a certain number of characters, you should use your National Insurance number followed by ‘IC’ and as much of your surname as possible.

Examples

If your name is Anne Jones and your National Insurance number is QQ123456A, you’d write the reference as QQ123456AICJONESA

If your name is John Douglas-Hamilton and your National Insurance number is QQ123456A, you’d write the reference as QQ123456AICDOUGLAS-HAMILTONJ

This NI + IC + SURNAME + INITIAL code is the one I actually used.

Will be interesting to see when the payments are credited. Since the code I used contains the NI number mentioned in the letter I think it shoudl be ok regardless.... maybe needs a human to click it though rather than being automatically credited - not sure...

[Deep Blue]

Just off the phone with the HMRC Central Office.

I’ve been told that the Government Gateway will NOT reflect changes from Class 3 to Class 2 NICs, and the HMRC system doesn’t communicate with the Pension system - hence the need to phone State Pensions.

The very helpful lady there tried to connect me to them internally - but 3 times it bounced just as the waiting musak was starting to play.

She sent them a callback request for me, we’ll see how that goes - not hopeful, but you never know!

This is consistent with my experiences too, both in terms of Government Gateway only allowing class 3 payments and the crappy phone system continually kicking me out.

Good luck getting it resolved!