Mitsui and Rakuten Vanguard wrappers make no sense.

[Jansen]

I hold some of these in my NiSA accounts because I couldn't buy anything else with my balance. I got Mitsui in 2017 and Rakuten in 2018 after I noticed Mitsui's fees.

- 三井住友DS－三井住友・バンガード海外株式ファンド
- 楽天－楽天・米国高配当株式インデックス・ファンド

I don't know which ETFs they're wrapping but they aren't performing at all compared to simply getting any of Vanguard's other funds, VOO,VOOV, VGT, VTI, etc. are all up about by 7~10% since 2017, whereas the above two funds have barely changed since. What gives?

I would appreciate if anyone could recommend where might be a better place for this year's remaining balance.

[TokyoWart]

Very interesting. I just compared the Mitsui returns (https://site0.sbisec.co.jp/marble/fund/ ... =27931B036) to Vanguard's VOO (https://investor.vanguard.com/etf/profile/voo) and you are correct. Huge gap in returns for 1 yr (9.47% vs 5.92%), 3 years (13.47% annualized vs 36.47% total) and 5 years (10.87% annualized vs 39.12% total). This really adds to my disappointment with the quality of investment products available here in Japan. I buy individual stocks in my NISA accounts (with at best uneven success) and was thinking of looking for some good ETF's here but your experience is discouraging me. It's a shame that retail investors in Japan are treated so poorly.

[tbsmj]

I just compared the Mitsui returns (https://site0.sbisec.co.jp/marble/fund/ ... =27931B036) to Vanguard's VOO (https://investor.vanguard.com/etf/profile/voo) and you are correct. Huge gap in returns for 1 yr (9.47% vs 5.92%), 3 years (13.47% annualized vs 36.47% total) and 5 years (10.87% annualized vs 39.12% total).

You seem to be looking at price change instead of total return. The same page claims that the total return on that fund has been 7.41% annualized over 5 years, say. This is less than VOO, but more than VT (6.65% annualized over the same period), which is a better point of comparison given the composition of that fund (and the extent to which the US market has overperformed other economies in recent years). Note also that raw return numbers are affected by exchange rates, so one should adjust for that to make fair comparison.

Anyway, not trying to defend that fund in particular, which seems to have a crazy ER of over 1%. I wouldn't touch that with a 10-foot pole. But let's not overstate the case either.

[TokyoWart]

tbsmj

You seem to be looking at price change instead of total return. The same page claims that the total return on that fund has been 7.41% annualized over 5 years, say. This is less than VOO, but more than VT (6.65% annualized over the same period), which is a better point of comparison given the composition of that fund (and the extent to which the US market has overperformed other economies in recent years). Note also that raw return numbers are affected by exchange rates, so one should adjust for that to make fair comparison.

You make several good points here; thank you for the correction. I think the 5 year comparison is easiest because the average exchange rates in 2014 and 2018 are close (both around 110).

Anyway, not trying to defend that fund in particular, which seems to have a crazy ER of over 1%. I wouldn't touch that with a 10-foot pole. But let's not overstate the case either.

I agree!

[StockBeard]

US tax witholding on dividends for Japan residents would also account for a 0.2% difference yearly. (10% tax * approx 2% dividend). I assume that is included in the Japanese wrappers, but would not show up in the US ones?

[captainspoke]

...
- 三井住友DS－三井住友・バンガード海外株式ファンド...

I don't know which ETFs they're wrapping but they aren't performing at all compared to simply getting any of Vanguard's other funds, VOO,VOOV, VGT, VTI, etc. are all up about by 7~10% since 2017, whereas the above two funds have barely changed since. What gives?
...

I'm not even an amateur on vanguard funds, nor on the wrapper-ized version of those here. But...

My quick take on the fund above is that it is a global fund (something like VT), while the other vanguard funds (such as VOO, certainly) are not global--US mkt only. After all, the name there is 海外株式ファンド, and if I just saw that (and knew vanguard was a US company), I might conclude it was 'world, ex-US', or maybe 'developed markets, ex-US'. Or at least those as possible alternatives to it being like VT.

This is reinforced when I click on that fund link (above), and apparently see a morningstar blurb like this:

・モーニングスターカテゴリ
国際株式・グローバル・除く日本（F）

...and when I 'read' that, it appears to be 'global, ex-Japan'.

Have I got that right, or am I completely off track?

If it is a global fund, that would go quite a ways to explain why it's not tracking the US S&P 500 (VOO).

[adamu]

Just replying to this point before it gets lost in the debate.

I would appreciate if anyone could recommend where might be a better place for this year's remaining balance.

The current favourite on these forums for a simple all-in-one Japan-domiciled solution is ｅＭＡＸＩＳ Ｓｌｉｍ 全世界株式（オール・カントリー）. It's quite a young fund, so we can't look at its past performance, but it follows the MSCI All Country World index, looks like a good global balanced fund, and is low-cost.

[Jansen]

・モーニングスターカテゴリ
国際株式・グローバル・除く日本（F）

...and when I 'read' that, it appears to be 'global, ex-Japan'.

Have I got that right, or am I completely off track?

If it is a global fund, that would go quite a ways to explain why it's not tracking the US S&P 500 (VOO).

I hadn't noticed this part, that does explain it somewhat. Still, the performance over the past 2 years has been disappointing. I must say though it has been an incredibly stable asset to hold. Back last year when all the markets were crashing and we had to resort to eating our children for food, the fund dipped barely more than -¥2000 for me.

The current favourite on these forums for a simple all-in-one Japan-domiciled solution is ｅＭＡＸＩＳ Ｓｌｉｍ 全世界株式（オール・カントリー）. It's quite a young fund, so we can't look at its past performance, but it follows the MSCI All Country World index, looks like a good global balanced fund, and is low-cost.

Thanks, I'll take a look at that.

[mule96]

- 三井住友DS－三井住友・バンガード海外株式ファンド

This exists since a long time, it contains the following 4 etfs: VUG (Vanguard Growth ETF, 32.5%), VVIAX (Vanguard Value Index Fund Admiral Shares, 32.5%), VEUPX (Vanguard European Stock Index Fund Institutional Plus Shares, 30%), VEIEX
(Vanguard Emerging Markets Stock Index Fund Investor Shares, 5%). So it is 65% US stocks, 30% European and 5% emerging markets. While the underlying Funds are not expensive, the wrapper pushes it above 1% - as you noticed this is quite expensive. Since 2018 its not performing worse than for example the sp500 index, and even better than VT. Depending on the timing in 2017 it looks different, but see the comment below and also other comments in this thread.

- 楽天－楽天・米国高配当株式インデックス・ファンド

This one is wrapping VYM (FTSE High Dividend Yield Index) and exists since the beginning of 2018. It doesn't hedge against the JPY and if my understanding is right it reinvests the dividends from VYM. The performance considering this is around the same, excluding any considerations on taxes etc.

2017 was a very good year for most stocks and it peaked in Jan 2018. And now its again at similar levels. I don't think those two performed really bad compared to the other examples you mention - the timing in 2017-2018 is significant for a comparison. If you just say in 2017, that is a large timeframe.

I can't judge how good those wrappers are, but in any case looking at such a short time frame is not ideal at all, especially since the market didn't move upwards since the beginning of 2018. My few thoughts about this .

[mighty58]

Can anybody tell me if currency had anything to do with the differences? Holding in the Japanese wrapper means you're holding in yen, and fluctuations there would easily eat up profits (unless the fund is hedged), no? Or an I missing something?