RetireJapan

Sorry if this is a basic question but any advice would be much appreciated. I am a British national and worked for a large Japanese corporation for a number of years. After 8 years in Japan I transferred to the US branch office as a local employee. I continued working in the US for several years before returning back to the UK in 2019. I have accrued +8years pension credits while in Japan and 3years of US social security credits.

My intension was always to return back to Japan however due to a change in circumstances I have decided to move back to the UK in 2019. Prior to moving to Japan I was always employed in the UK and am on track to accrue sufficient tax credits to claim a full pension.

So I was thinking about how I could use the US social Security credits. I understand that the rules on pensions have changed and that it is possible to claim a Japanese state pension if you have +10 year pension credits. I appreciate that this will not be a large sum but it all counts. I also read up that there is a tax treaty that allows you to transfer US social security credit to Japan.

How do I do this? How feasible is it given that I am not resident in either of these countries?

Any help or advice would be much appreciated.

Totalization doesn't allow you to "transfer" credits in the sense of increasing one country's pension, it allows Social Security coverage in one country to qualify you for coverage in another, with each country separately paying its own (prorated) benefits. When totalization applies, you end up with as many pensions as countries whose systems you have contributed to.

Since you've said you're on track to qualify for a UK pension, why not use that status to satisfy coverage requirements for both Japan and the US? In other words, do UK-US totalization and UK-Japan totalization without worrying about somehow coordinating between Japan and the US. I'd suggest checking with the UK's Pension Service to confirm if/how it could be done, but they probably already have experience with such cases and should be able to give you reliable information.

In practical terms, there probably isn't anything concrete to do until you actually reach retirement age, but it would be nice to find out that you are able to initiate the application process from home, so to speak.

ClearAsMud wrote: ↑Wed Mar 29, 2023 6:32 am Since you've said you're on track to qualify for a UK pension, why not use that status to satisfy coverage requirements for both Japan and the US? In other words, do UK-US totalization and UK-Japan totalization without worrying about somehow coordinating between Japan and the US.

The UK-Japan pension treaty does not enable totalisation, unfortunately.

So using US credits to qualify for a Japanese pension (120 months required) seems like a reasonable plan, assuming it can be done (it is possible to receive both the UK and Japanese pension at the same time). There is also the 空期間 thing where you might be able to get 'credits' (to vest, not to increase the pension) for years between turning 20 and coming to Japan.

As I understand it, the Pension Treaty between the UK and Japan does not allow for totalization.

https://www.nenkin.go.jp/international/ ... tatus.html

The Pension Treaty between the UK and the US does allow for totalization.

The Pension Treaty between the US and Japan does allow for totalization.

https://www.nenkin.go.jp/international/ ... tesus.html

You left it too long after leaving Japan to claim back the Lump Sum refund, and in any case, the Lump Sum would only have paid out 5 out of the 8 years' contributions, so you would have irretrievably lost 3 years' contributions.

https://www.nenkin.go.jp/international/ ... nsion.html

Japan calculates in months, so with the 8 years' (96 months' ??) contributions in Japan, and 3 years' (12 US Credits x 3 = 36 months' ?? ) credits in US, you can meet the minimum qualification requirement for the Japanese Pension when you reach Japanese Retirement Age.
Once achieving the minimum qualification, you would receive a Japanese Pension equal to 96 (???) / 480 or about 20% of the Japanese Basic Pension, currently \777,800/ year x 20% = 155,560 per year Basic Pension, adjusted for Cost of Living...

PLUS

The Kosei Nenkin piece, which is based on your Income Level whilst in Japan...

https://www.nenkin.go.jp/international/ ... index.html

I am just working on almost the exact same case for a retired friend in the UK, and he will receive something like GBP 4k per year from his Japan Pension (Basic + Kousei). It's better than a poke in the eye with a sharp stick... And it is not subject to Japanese Withholding Taxes, so Tax Free in Japan, but taxable in the UK.

The minimum to receive a US Pension is also 10 years' qualification, so you could use UK or Japan time to qualify
Check the US Social Security Website
https://www.ssa.gov/retirement/eligibility

RetireJapan wrote: ↑Wed Mar 29, 2023 7:36 am The UK-Japan pension treaty does not enable totalisation, unfortunately.

Well, so much for the easy way.

Totalization between Japan and the US, then, might be the only option to qualify for a Japanese pension, and whether that option is open to nonresidents is a question probably only the Japanese pension authorities will be able to answer with certainty. It shouldn't be impossible, though, one would think. The basic procedure would be as follows:

• Apply for your Japanese pension by sending a pension application to the Japanese pension office with jurisdiction over your last place of residence. The application form itself can be downloaded from this page.
• Attach the simple Declaration of Period of Coverage form to the application.
• At the same time, submit a Temporary Application for U.S. Social Security Benefits.
• Wait to be contacted by both the Japan Pension Service and the Social Security Administration.

For reference, the totalization and temporary application forms are both available from the same Japan Pension Service page.

Instead of waiting until you actually submit an application, you might ask a friend in Japan to go to the pension office in person to ask about the possibility. That would probably be the quickest way of obtaining more-or-less reliable information. Or you could try writing to the relevant Japanese pension office yourself to confirm your eligibility. Or (long shot though it may be) you might even try contacting the Federal Benefits Unit at the US Embassy in London to see if they can offer any advice.

Thank you all for the responses and PM's. Very helpful. Quite a few forms and documents that need to be collected but wouldn't expect it any other way in Japan. I am still in my early 50s so have some years to go before I can claim a pension. All this investigation started when I was doing a clear out of some old documents when I found my blue pension book. Will make sure that it is kept safe!