NISA change proposals

[sutebayashi]

So what’s the current advice?
I have ¥200,000 in a tsumitate NISA (Rakuten - emaxis slim all country). I was assuming it’d just continue as normal, but is it better to change to the super new NISA now? Is tsumitate continuing?

Yes continue as normal, as you would intend anyway.
The changes to NISA will only be for us to take advantage of from 2024, so 2023 is the story as 2022 was.
And tsumitate will be a feature still after the changes.

I only put ¥10,000 in a month, but was thinking of upping to ¥20,000 in 2023.

Yep, go ahead and do that.

NISA is after all just a tax break on investments, and my personal view is it is better to not think about the tax breaks too much, and think about the investments most. The tax stuff matters, but more around the margins.

[TokyoBoglehead]

So what’s the current advice?
I have ¥200,000 in a tsumitate NISA (Rakuten - emaxis slim all country). I was assuming it’d just continue as normal, but is it better to change to the super new NISA now? Is tsumitate continuing?

Yes continue as normal, as you would intend anyway.
The changes to NISA will only be for us to take advantage of from 2024, so 2023 is the story as 2022 was.
And tsumitate will be a feature still after the changes.

I only put ¥10,000 in a month, but was thinking of upping to ¥20,000 in 2023.

Yep, go ahead and do that.

NISA is after all just a tax break on investments, and my personal view is it is better to not think about the tax breaks too much, and think about the investments most. The tax stuff matters, but more around the margins.

I would say there is even MORE incentive to fill up your 2023 allowance.

2024 - on - nISA will be a lifetime allowance.

2023 nISA is use it or lose it.

[goran]

I would say there is even MORE incentive to fill up your 2023 allowance.

2024 - on - nISA will be a lifetime allowance.

2023 nISA is use it or lose it.

from 2024, is it going to be lifetime 18million minus (everything I have put into NISA upto now)?

let's say, if I already have 2 million in NISA by the end of 2023, then from 2024, my lifetime allowance would be 18m - 2m = 16m?

[RetireJapan]

So what’s the current advice?
I have ¥200,000 in a tsumitate NISA (Rakuten - emaxis slim all country). I was assuming it’d just continue as normal, but is it better to change to the super new NISA now? Is tsumitate continuing? I only put ¥10,000 in a month, but was thinking of upping to ¥20,000 in 2023.
I know it’s only small change compared to most here but I just want to make sure I’m doing the best thing for my money/future.

Current accounts will remain until they expire. New money from 2024 will go into the new eternal NISA.

You probably won't need to change anything going forward.

[TokyoBoglehead]

I would say there is even MORE incentive to fill up your 2023 allowance.

2024 - on - nISA will be a lifetime allowance.

2023 nISA is use it or lose it.

from 2024, is it going to be lifetime 18million minus (everything I have put into NISA upto now)?

let's say, if I already have 2 million in NISA by the end of 2023, then from 2024, my lifetime allowance would be 18m - 2m = 16m?

Nope, separate allowance. Precious NiSAs do not count towards it!

So 18m + (2 m)

[sutebayashi]

Nope, separate allowance. Precious NiSAs do not count towards it!

So that separate treatment is confirmed, is it? If so, happy days for those oldies like me who have already maxed them out then.

Maxing out the junior NISAs is something I’ve been doing too, so if the separation applies there too, then my kids with their Junior NISAs are also going to have that tax free, as well as this extra lifetime 18m allowance, should they choose to use it?
(If juniors can have external NISAs too then it does seem to be rather ripe for tax avoidance on the part of the parents. Some kids would be turning 18 with 22 million invested. For a family of 4, pre-existing NISA users, they could be looking at circa 90 million invested tax free?)

Edit : hmmm, but then there is the annual gift tax limits to be wary of, so maybe 90 million would be difficult.

[TokyoBoglehead]

Nope, separate allowance. Precious NiSAs do not count towards it!

So that separate treatment is confirmed, is it? If so, happy days for those oldies like me who have already maxed them out then.

Maxing out the junior NISAs is something I’ve been doing too, so if the separation applies there too, then my kids with their Junior NISAs are also going to have that tax free, as well as this extra lifetime 18m allowance, should they choose to use it?
(If juniors can have external NISAs too then it does seem to be rather ripe for tax avoidance on the part of the parents. Some kids would be turning 18 with 22 million invested. For a family of 4, pre-existing NISA users, they could be looking at circa 90 million invested tax free?)

Edit : hmmm, but then there is the annual gift tax limits to be wary of, so maybe 90 million would be difficult.

No confirmation on under 18 accounts.

Doesn't look good. I'd say 3:1 outside chance.

[sutebayashi]

Found this article on the treatment of existing NISAs:
https://news.yahoo.co.jp/articles/0b2d6 ... cc8?page=2

By my read, it notes the existing plain NISA investment period ends after 5 years, so this year was the last chance for a rollover. No more rollover from the end 2023 right.

But the rules for tsumitate nisa were different, and so the existing tsumitate nisa users are to be in luck, being able to continue that for longer.

If that’s right, then folks like me with a plain NISA won’t get much benefit actually, we’ll have to sell or move balances after 5 years out to a tokutei account. (From there, funds straight back to the new eternal NISA, up to 18 million, would be the plan.)

[OwenM]

I would say there is even MORE incentive to fill up your 2023 allowance.

2024 - on - nISA will be a lifetime allowance.

2023 nISA is use it or lose it.

from 2024, is it going to be lifetime 18million minus (everything I have put into NISA upto now)?

let's say, if I already have 2 million in NISA by the end of 2023, then from 2024, my lifetime allowance would be 18m - 2m = 16m?

Nope, separate allowance. Precious NiSAs do not count towards it!

So 18m + (2 m)

Do you have a source for this information? Would like to pass it on to my Japanese partner

[TokyoBoglehead]

from 2024, is it going to be lifetime 18million minus (everything I have put into NISA upto now)?

let's say, if I already have 2 million in NISA by the end of 2023, then from 2024, my lifetime allowance would be 18m - 2m = 16m?

Nope, separate allowance. Precious NiSAs do not count towards it!

So 18m + (2 m)

Do you have a source for this information? Would like to pass it on to my Japanese partner

I shared this article with my wife, she said it was easy to understand! https://randomwalker.blog.fc2.com/blog-entry-4723.html