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Re: Australians, let’s chip in for a willing and competent Tax Lawyer w
Posted: Wed Dec 22, 2021 11:19 am
by EmaxisSlim Cultist
Tkydon wrote: ↑Tue Dec 21, 2021 3:39 pm
Can you start a new thread for Canadians?
Crypto in Japan is classed as Miscellaneous Income.
What specific issues do you face as a Canadian?
Re: Australians, let’s chip in for a willing and competent Tax Lawyer w
Posted: Wed Dec 22, 2021 11:30 am
by Tkydon
Not me. 7-Seasons.com
7-seasons.com wrote: ↑Thu Dec 09, 2021 12:27 pm
It sounds like there are some people with tax experience on this thread so I am going to throw out my own Hail Mary:
If we swap out this thread's Australia with Canada and rental income with trading / crypto capital gains, what would be the tax procedure form and/or recommended tax accountant for a permanent resident?
Re: Australians, let’s chip in for a willing and competent Tax Lawyer w
Posted: Wed Dec 29, 2021 10:38 pm
by ayetobee
This is wonderful information, thank you to the Aussie ex-pats posting on this it is really helpful information for me.
AustinJapan: I noticed you mentioned Atlas Wealth as an advisor you have used. I have had an initial consultation with them and am on the verge of engaging them. Could you let me know anything regarding your experience?
I have also found a Japanese Tax Accountant who speaks English and worked for the big four (PWC, I believe). Her details were shared with me by an ex-pat accountant in Australia who had worked with her in the past. I had some challenges with asking direct questions and getting direct answers because I kept confusing the positive yes and the negative yes based on my questions (which is the opposite in Australia - when I say no you're right, it's because you asked the question in the negative) which made for peculiar email exchanges, but we got there. I am happy to share her details via IM if appropriate.
I am going to do some research on the taxation process as advised here, thank you again, I will post questions as I encounter them.
Re: Australians, let’s chip in for a willing and competent Tax Lawyer w
Posted: Sat Apr 08, 2023 7:09 am
by hbd
Tokyo and others on this now rather old thread:
' Sort of. If you have paid Oz income tax on the property, then it’s unlikely your Japanese national tax will change, if at all since you are eligible for tax credits. What will change, however, is your prefectural and city taxes since they regard these as not being paid. (That’s another sore point for discussion later. ) '
I'm very worried about the 住民税 side, but even the national tax is currently a problem. As a law-abiding Permanent Res here (and therefore a non-res for tax purposes in Australia) I had this bitter experience when I went to do the Kakuei shinkoku yesterday: Having paid my Oz tax at the 32.5% rate on the income (after deductions) from letting out my flat, I was assuming I'd get a tax credit in Japan for just about the whole amount of ca17万円。Imagine my astonishment when they told me that a mere 3万 can be deducted, and I now owe the JTO around 10万 for the 不動産 portion of my tax return！ If that's correct, I might as well keep the flat empty because with the high local property rates, high body corporate/strata fees and high tax, I'm making almost no money for all the trouble of being a landlord from 7,000kms distance. The rationale for my having to pay even more tax to the JTO after already paying the ATO at 32.5% was explained to me as follows: The foreign income (my only form of foreign income, by the way) that I receive from letting out the property represents 7% of my total taxable income, so therefore the total amount of tax that must be paid on that portion of my income must be 7% of my total tax liability. I'm a tenured academic here with a reasonable salary. The JTO is saying that I must pay ca.27万 (a little under 7% of my total tax liability of around 350万）, but have only paid the equivalent of 17万to the ATO, so now owe the JTO a further ca.10万!!
How can that be true after I've already paid such a high rate of tax in Australia? It feels like a classic case of 'double taxation', but of course the 条約 between J and Au says nothing in detail about such scenarios.
I decided not to pay the tax yet, and would like to go back on Monday to dispute their claim. Can anyone please shed light on this conundrum?
Re: Australians, let’s chip in for a willing and competent Tax Lawyer w
Posted: Sun Apr 09, 2023 12:06 am
by Wales4rugbyWC23
hbd wrote: ↑Sat Apr 08, 2023 7:09 am
Tokyo and others on this now rather old thread:
' Sort of. If you have paid Oz income tax on the property, then it’s unlikely your Japanese national tax will change, if at all since you are eligible for tax credits. What will change, however, is your prefectural and city taxes since they regard these as not being paid. (That’s another sore point for discussion later. ) '
I'm very worried about the 住民税 side, but even the national tax is currently a problem. As a law-abiding Permanent Res here (and therefore a non-res for tax purposes in Australia) I had this bitter experience when I went to do the Kakuei shinkoku yesterday: Having paid my Oz tax at the 32.5% rate on the income (after deductions) from letting out my flat, I was assuming I'd get a tax credit in Japan for just about the whole amount of ca17万円。Imagine my astonishment when they told me that a mere 3万 can be deducted, and I now owe the JTO around 10万 for the 不動産 portion of my tax return！ If that's correct, I might as well keep the flat empty because with the high local property rates, high body corporate/strata fees and high tax, I'm making almost no money for all the trouble of being a landlord from 7,000kms distance. The rationale for my having to pay even more tax to the JTO after already paying the ATO at 32.5% was explained to me as follows: The foreign income (my only form of foreign income, by the way) that I receive from letting out the property
represents 7% of my total taxable income, so therefore the total amount of tax that must be paid on that portion of my income must be 7% of my total tax liability. I'm a tenured academic here with a reasonable salary. The JTO is saying that I must pay ca.27万 (a little under 7% of my total tax liability of around 350万）, but have only paid the equivalent of 17万to the ATO, so now owe the JTO a further ca.10万!!
How can that be true after I've already paid such a high rate of tax in Australia? It feels like a classic case of 'double taxation', but of course the 条約 between J and Au says nothing in detail about such scenarios.
I decided not to pay the tax yet, and would like to go back on Monday to dispute their claim. Can anyone please shed light on this conundrum?
Just a quick question, when did you buy your apartment?
Re: Australians, let’s chip in for a willing and competent Tax Lawyer w
Posted: Sun Apr 09, 2023 4:17 am
by hbd
Thanks. The purchase was made during May-June 2021 (settlement in June). Too late for any 'depreciation' deductions, as I understand.
After learning that I have 3 years to seek redress for overpayment, I'm going to pay up this week, unless they'll allow a recalculation on the basis of certain expenses / keihi経費 that I forgot to inform them of last Friday (unlikely!)
In any case I'll then face the residence taxes (住民税), which, when tallied with the Oz-side tax at 32.5% rate, and the ca.100,000 in national taxes, will probably mean I'll have paid tax on the very modest income from the flat at a rate of well over 50%! There simply has to be a better way.
Re: Australians, let’s chip in for a willing and competent Tax Lawyer w
Posted: Sun Apr 09, 2023 1:50 pm
by Wales4rugbyWC23
hbd wrote: ↑Sun Apr 09, 2023 4:17 am
Thanks. The purchase was made during May-June 2021 (settlement in June). Too late for any 'depreciation' deductions, as I understand.
After learning that I have 3 years to seek redress for overpayment, I'm going to pay up this week, unless they'll allow a recalculation on the basis of certain expenses / keihi経費 that I forgot to inform them of last Friday (unlikely!)
In any case I'll then face the residence taxes (住民税), which, when tallied with the Oz-side tax at 32.5% rate, and the ca.100,000 in national taxes, will probably mean I'll have paid tax on the very modest income from the flat at a rate of well over 50%! There simply has to be a better way.
You just missed it, but do you have a mortgage? The interest is tax deductible on your Japanese tax return.
Re: Australians, let’s chip in for a willing and competent Tax Lawyer w
Posted: Tue Apr 11, 2023 11:41 am
by hbd
Thankyou. Not any more. Yesterday I did, however, find other expenses to deduct, and the result was a completely different assessment. (I've described what happened in more detail in the "Help with taxes" thread. Mind you, it's never over til it's over, so I will wait and see whether someone back offices in the decides my expenses claims are invalid!)
Re: Australians, let’s chip in for a willing and competent Tax Lawyer w
Posted: Wed Apr 12, 2023 2:59 am
by Tokyo
@hbd. Sorry to hear of your battles with JTO but it’s promising that you seem to making progress more recently.
While I would like to offer sound advice on minimizing your “double taxation” problems, I am afraid I have basically given up the battle. Nowadays I just submit everything to my Japanese accountant and let him handle all the details. I used to get frustrated by tax returns since I also pay a lot of tax in Australia and because of the very different systems in place, appear to be paying yet more tax on Australian income at this end as well. As a result, I am trying a new approach to tax: I assume the odds are stacked against me to ensure that I will always have to pay more than my fair share. It’s much less frustrating this way.
Re: Australians, let’s chip in for a willing and competent Tax Lawyer w
Posted: Sun Sep 03, 2023 12:35 pm
by 7-seasons.com
EmaxisSlim Cultist wrote: ↑Wed Dec 22, 2021 11:19 am
Tkydon wrote: ↑Tue Dec 21, 2021 3:39 pm
Can you start a new thread for Canadians?
Crypto in Japan is classed as Miscellaneous Income.
What specific issues do you face as a Canadian?
Everything went well. I paid a hefty tax bill and received a bit back 8 months after filing because I paid too much. The misc. income ended up being taxed somewhere around 12%. I had called the tax office to confirm and they said crypto in misc. income as people say.