FIRE getting popular in Japan

[beanhead]

I think there is a lot of thinking that you are somehow 'lazy' if you quit work early.

Unless of course you are wealthy and inherit land or money. If so, it is perfectly acceptable to lead a life of leisure.

I know a few guys who have family land. They potter around mowing their lawn or cleaning their cars all day. Have rental apartments so sweeping outside the entrance is their 'work'.

Not something I aspire to, to be honest. I need a bit more human interaction than just collecting rent from the tenants!

[mighty58]

Saw a post today that illustrates well the predominant Japanese mentality when it comes to FIRE and the 4% rule. I have a lot of respect for this blogger, who has achieved FIRE on a dividend strategy, but it's interesting that even he characterizes seeking 4% as "high risk", and says it would be difficult to achieve without going into high-yield/high-risk investments.

Contrast that with the predominant view overseas that 4% is the minimum safe withdrawal rate, i.e. the conservative line at which your chances of success are extremely high. Also, contrary to high-risk, you need only invest in the market.

https://zz597.blogspot.com/2021/09/254.html

[RetireJapan]

I read Ranpa's blog, but I can't say I'm particularly impressed by their take on investing.

Been whining a lot recently about price falls on their REITs too.

[mighty58]

Agreed... he seems close to FIRE proponents from the west in terms of lifestyle philosophy, but his investment approach is so very Japanese.

[RetireJapan]

On the other hand seems to have enough assets that he only needs to generate a 2% return to fund current lifestyle. Not bad!

[mighty58]

Article in the Japan TImes today on the FIRE trend in Japan:
How to retire in Japan decades earlier than you think
https://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/2021/ ... etirement/

Very happy to see more Japanese people reject the lifetime-salaryman framework conceptually, but man... the investment strategy... those profiled in the article are dependent on dividends and seem to be quite actively managing their portfolios based on recent movements/trends, sounds like a recipe for disaster to me.

[zeroshiki]

I saw an article on Rakuten Toshiru (their investment blog tied to Rakuten Securities) and they interviewed a bunch of investors on best strategies for NISA and IDECO. I swear to God, one dude probably had no idea what NISA was because his answer was that since NISA was tax free, you should get in on IPOs and stash the shares in there and when they do the initial price bump, sell them.

[EmaxisSlim Cultist]

I saw an article on Rakuten Toshiru (their investment blog tied to Rakuten Securities) and they interviewed a bunch of investors on best strategies for NISA and IDECO. I swear to God, one dude probably had no idea what NISA was because his answer was that since NISA was tax free, you should get in on IPOs and stash the shares in there and when they do the initial price bump, sell them.

This is similar to how Peter Theil manages to have a 1 billion dollar IRA.

https://www.propublica.org/article/lord ... piggy-bank

Lol, the idea of putting your lottery tickets into your single best investment tool is pretty crazy.

[Bubblegun]

I’ve been reading about this, and every time I read something about how they saved 50% this and what ever
I seem to get an undercurrent feeling that these people aren’t really your average joe.
One guys a banker and got huge bonuses, another guy was a tech guy who again, wasn’t earning your average salary.
Some couple who were lawyers or other well paid professionals that again weren’t your average earners.
Then there’s one guy saying how he doesn’t work but ironically does because he tells everyone else how to do it , thereby getting an income from that, and again is way above average earnings .
Is it me or are these people doing FIRE earning way above wage earners and that the FIRE isn’t really for the average Joe blogs? Remembering that the average teacher, nurse has to buy a house, etc etc!
Of course it’s great if you can negotiate redundancy and severance pay etc etc but for most working people saving for retirement, that’s just not going to happen for 90% of people.

Are there any blogs of Joe average doing this who earns an average salary a year? With kids, and buying an average house?

I’m never going to retire that early but I’d like to enjoy my life a couple of years before retirement.

[mighty58]

You raise a lot of the common arguments against the FIRE movement:
- it's only for high earners
- it's only for those crazy frugal types who live like a bum, scheme for free food, and wipe their mouth with reused paper towels.
- these guys are calling themselves retired but they're working?! Hey, WTF?

The beauty of FI is that it's based on percentage of savings, so it's possible across the income spectrum. Now obviously, a high earner can save more, and do it quicker, than a low earner can, that's not rocket science, but again, it's about percentages. It's about cutting waste, raising income, investing, and living well and happily, all at the same time. And the point of FI is not really to "retire" per se, it's to achieve financial independence to do what you like. If doing that happens to bring in extra money, all the better.
Mr Money Mustache does a much better job than I could though... here's one of his posts where he takes on some of the common criticisms:
https://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2018/10 ... -movement/